Fun With Sleep [Archive] - The Hypertribe

Koliedrus

01-10-2001, 01:15 PM

I couldn't ask for a better group http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

"Before you can write poetry, you must first learn the alphabet". In essence, that statement also applies to the art of dream control. No matter your natural ability, (be it painting, writing, sculpting, music composition, programming, etc) a certain amount of schooling can only add to the talent you already have.

Like it or not, dreaming is a talent you already practice on a regular basis. For most, dreams control the dreamer. For a very few, though...

I'll first show you how to strengthen your ability to recognize a dream when you're having one. With time and persistence, you'll eventually be able to call up part of your logical waking mind as your dreams occur. From there my friend, your imagination is the only limit to your experience. Believe me when I say that it's worth the effort.

Ask yourself the following question:
"Am I dreaming right now?"

Most likely you answered "Hell no!"

Before I'm done with you, you'll be asking that question several times during the course of a day (unless you're a philosophy student, but I won't go there). Eventually, you'll answer "Yes!"

Remember that notebook I asked you to get? You'll need it. The first thing you're going to do is keep a Dream Journal. Don't worry. It's not for others to read. It's primary function is to help you with dream recall.

The next time you head for bed, have your Journal and a pen close by. Remind yourself that it's there when you close your eyes.

At some point during the night, you may wake up from a dream. Remember the Journal. Jot down notes, write full pages, draw pictures, describe emotions. The amount of detail is up to you. Your notes to yourself don't have to be anything more than cues for you to recall portions of your dream.

No matter how vivid the dream seems to be when you first wake up, your mind will try to erase it and start over when you fall back to sleep, so it's IMPORTANT that you transcribe your notes when they're fresh.

Don't worry if it doesn't happen on the first night. Try again on the next night and the night after. It'll happen.

Leave a blank page between each dream. We'll use those pages later.

A WORD OF CAUTION:

Sometimes the preparation for dream control will cause a lucid dream on one of the first tries. Anticipation is usually the reason. If you experience a lucid dream early on, you're on your way. Don't be surprised if it doesn't happen again when you make an effort to induce one. One of the reasons for this lesson is not only to teach you control of your dreams but to help you choose when you wish to experience a controlled dream.

To commemorate the beginning of your training, I hereby designate you as HyperNauts
'nuff said for now?

I thought so http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif

Chime in as you see fit. I'll answer questions asap.

The Rapist

01-11-2001, 05:35 AM

K
I have recently been experimenting with Relaxation deep-breathing. Do you do any other preparation prior to going to sleep toward inducing a dream state? Have you found any other means to "induce" the experience with heightened intensity?

Mr. Snrub

01-11-2001, 09:24 AM

The only time i dream i.e. have dreams that i can actually remember when i wake up is when i sleep badly. And i've always been able to lucid dream, no idea how i achieved this, but i can always recognize when i am dreaming and take control.

Koliedrus

01-11-2001, 01:57 PM

You're above average, Mr. Snrub. Although most people (like you) rarely remember a dream unless under unusual circumstances, fewer still ever experience lucidity with any frequency (much less gain control of a lucid dream). We'll work further on increasing dream-recall soon.

Rapist brings up a point that I take for granted.

You cannot induce a lucid dream if you are unable to relax. There are a couple of methods I have in mind. Here's one:

PROGRESSIVE RELAXATION:
-----------------------

1. Lie down on a firm surface and close your eyes. (This also works if you sit in a comfortable chair. I won't be held responsible if you practice this on the job)

2. Breath. If you stop, you'll die. Try to control how you do it by paying attention to each breath. Breath deeply a few times by using your diaphragm. Your belly should pooch out as you draw air to the very bottom of your lungs. As you exhale, imagine that you're puffing out a cloud of tension. Think about nothing but your breathing.

3. Tense and relax muscle groups. If you're right handed, start with your right wrist. Bend your hand backward toward your forearm, hold it tight for about 5 seconds. Notice the tension in the muscles and release. Pause for about 20 seconds and do it again (same hand, same muscle group). Take another deep breath from the diaphragm and exhale slowly. Start again with the other wrist and repeat. Next, go to the muscles in your right forearm. Same procedure then on to the left forearm. Keep doing this for upper arms, shoulders, jaw, neck, back, abdomen, butt, thighs, calves, and ankles. Pause for 20 seconds between each muscle group, take a deep breath and release the tension into your exhale.

4. Go limp (quiet now, class http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif ). Let all of the muscle groups relax. If there's still tension somewhere, work on that muscle group again. Each time you do, the relaxation will be greater than the tension before.

The second method is a little more detailed and Zennish, if you will. I'll post it in a different message since it requires visual aid.

Get those notebooks if you want to follow along. We'll get into recognizing Dreamsigns soon.

Koliedrus

01-11-2001, 02:14 PM

Here's the second method of relaxation. If the image isn't right on this first post, I'll edit it later.

61-POINT RELAXATION
-------------------

1. Study the following figure, ignore the gender and lack of genitals for now and memorize the sequence.

<IMG SRC="http://personal.lig.bellsouth.net/lig/m/p/mpplem/pics/relpoints.jpg" border=0>

Notice that the sequence begins and ends at the forehead.

2. Focus on each point, one at a time. Start with the point between your eyes and think of the number ONE. Imagine nothing else but this point. Think of yourself as existing there and only there. Before moving on to the next point you should feel warmth, heaviness or tingling between your eyebrows.

3. Move through each point in the same way. Don't let your mind wander. That's not easy! If you lose your place, start over from the beginning. Practice with 31 points until you "get it".

4. Try for all 61 points. When you can get 31 points without losing your focus, proceed with the rest of the points.

Questions?

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 05-19-2001).]

King Bastard

01-11-2001, 04:18 PM

Umm, yeah. Are any of these relaxation techniques similar in execution to staring into a candles flame to reach an.... err "Altered State"? Just want to get my head screwed on right before I go and loosen it all up http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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I'm a firm beliver in a ruling class, especially since I rule: Randall Graves-Clerks

Koliedrus

01-11-2001, 06:35 PM

No. The main difference is that the methods we'll be using are "self-contained". All that is required is you and your mind.

Listening to water flow or staring into a fireplace are indeed relaxing events. The two methods I've described exclude all external stimulus so that your mind becomes the center of attention and the source of all stimulus.

The point is not to be lulled into relaxation but to retain cognition as you initialize a relaxed state.

Good question, KB http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-11-2001).]

Koliedrus

01-12-2001, 02:26 PM

Dreamsigns v1.0
---------------

What the hell. It's Friday so I'll ease up on the semi-formal explanations. I'll work up the categories and sub-categories later. You already have enough to keep you busy for a while.

Have you ever had a dream that seemed familiar? There's probably something in that type of dream that has appeared in others.

I have an entire city (as yet unnamed) that I visit regularly. The buildings, streets, parks and even the interiors of some structures are all familiar to me, yet it is unlike any city I have ever visited.

When I find myself in that city, I know I'm dreaming.

That is one of my Dreamsigns; something that let's my sleeping mind know that my seemingly real experience is in fact a dream.

Dreamsigns come in many forms. Unfortunately most people experience them during nightmares; strong emotions, impossible transformations and the like. Believe it or not, if you have a recurring nightmare your chances of recognizing dreamsigns and gaining control are greater than if you typically have placid dreams (with training and you're welcome).

Here's where your Dream Journal comes in. Once you wake up, the nightmare is still vivid in your mind.

REMEMBER THE JOURNAL AND START MAKING NOTES!!!

Here's one from my early notes.

-----------------------------------------

Riding a horse. Cliff on left, ocean beyond (coast of Spain?) Nice day. Sun and a few clouds. Pleasant smell. Hands become snake heads. No control. Snakes bites horse over and over. She screams and we fall over the cliff.

-----------------------------------------

Yeah yeah, I know. Your first instinct is to try to interpret the dream. Don't bother. Uncontrolled dreams are a mishmash of your experiences and imagination. (I've never been to Spain).

If only I knew then what I know now. The dreamsigns are abundant; location, smell, transformation and falling are the obvious ones.

When I post (formally) again, I'll give you a list of dreamsign categories and subs. In the meantime, use what you know thus far and try to document a dream (more if you're able).

Remember to leave a blank page between dreams.

Ok, I wasn't going to do this but it's the weekend. Here's a quicky that might get a lucid dream started (no promises). I'm taking for granted that you have eight hours to sleep (neither do I. It's an average so cut me some slack) :

1. Set your alarm for four hours after you go to bed. Don't worry about having dreams or not during this time. Most of your dreams happen at the end of your regular sleeping period. We're going to isolate that time.

2. When you hear the alarm, get your ass out of bed! Get up and do something you're used to. Screw around on the computer, pay some bills, take a walk, do some laundry. It doesn't matter as long as it's in your regular routine. For goddsake stay away from the TV or you'll just waste your effort.

3. After you've been awake an hour, think about going back to sleep and taking part of your waking mind with you. Think about where you want to go, what you'd like to do, who you want to see... Pick your dream and concentrate on it for thirty minutes and then HIT THE SHEETS!

4. Sleep for two and a half hours. Use one of the relaxation induction methods above. The target dream you chose should float on your awareness as oil floats on water. As you relax, the "oil" will thicken. Watch the images behind your eyes but don't try to change them. Just watch and remember your target dream.

5. Wake up and report. For chrissake, give us some feedback! If you'd like to contact me instead of publishing your experience in the forum, my address is koliedrus@yahoo.com

Good luck, Hypernauts and have a great weekend!

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-12-2001).]

Escape Artist

01-13-2001, 12:32 PM

Count me in. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

Rabble Rouser

01-14-2001, 11:58 AM

*grabs a pen and a notebook*

When will the first test be? http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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"You did it, Nibbles! Now, nibble through my ball sack!" - Principal Skinner

Koliedrus

01-14-2001, 12:36 PM

Originally posted by Rabble Rouser:
*grabs a pen and a notebook*

When will the first test be? http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif



Just now. You passed http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

Your interest is the main concern here.

Who doesn't like to sleep? When we go without it for extended periods of time, we feel the need to make it up. When we finally get the chance, we sleep longer than normal.

Have you ever noticed that at the end of a long sleep, you tend to want to stay in bed and go back to some of the dreams you just had?

Sometimes you wake up just a little bit. The essence of your dream lingers in your memory but you just can't grasp it long enough to keep it in your mind.

When you open your eyes, it's as if you had just experienced someone else's life.

I'm going to do my best to teach you how to retain your dreams so that they will no longer seem to be part of someone else (You Sleeping).

Keep in mind though, this takes work and time! You can half-ass it to an extent but you MUST PRACTICE!

We all go to sleep eventually. I'm asking you to take some of the thoughts in this thread with you when you close your eyes. You don't have to stay alert. Just take part of your waking mind with you.

Ok, it's time I got to work on a more formal post.

Feel free to discuss relevant issues while I work on the next lesson.

I sincerely appreciate your interest. I'll make it worth your while.

------------------
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Koliedrus

01-14-2001, 03:21 PM

Dreamsigns v1.2
---------------

A Dreamsign, simply, is some event that you can recognize during a dream that will let you know that the experience you're having exists outside of your physical reality.

Dreamsigns manifest themselves in many forms. Below you'll find a list and some descriptions of how they may appear to you as you're dreaming.
I'll site some examples from experience to help you along.

AWARENESS

Sometimes during a dream, you'll have a thought or emotion that is stronger than what you would have if you were awake. Here are some examples. I'll use the following pattern for each category (Awareness is the first category, Thoughts the first sub-category etc.)

THOUGHTS

"I couldn't figure out how to work the lock. While I was trying to open the door, it swung open on its own"

"I didn't want to crash into the car in front of me. My car drove
itself around the traffic jam."

EMOTIONS

"Although I didn't know her, her funeral brought me to tears"

"Everyone was waving their hands and jamming to my music!"

SENSATIONS

"I felt myself float off of the bed but I got tangled in the sheets.

"She rubbed her hands all over me. I wanted her more than life"

"It was like having pins stuck in my ears!"

PERCEPTIONS

"My contacts fell out but I could see clearly"

"It was just like I had choked down a case of beer"

"Even though they were a mile away, I could hear every word"

ACTION

This type of dreamsign deals with some impossible event between you and some other person or thing in your dream.

EGO

"I'm flying to work on a penguin"

"I was standing on the moon without a spacesuit, but I was breathing"

"Lifting the mule over my head was no trouble"

CHARACTER

"The tribe hisses at my pitiful attempt"

"Zoey locks her exotic gaze on my eyes and plants a big smooch on me right there in front of my mom"

"The cop tells me to step out of the vehicle and proceeds to carve a blueprint on my back"

OBJECT

"A broom in the corner of the room starts to glow"

"The plane begins to dive and we can't pull up"

"As if guided by an unseen hand, the pen begins to write"

FORM

Either you or some other person or object takes on a different shape. Remember the snakehands? This is it.

EGO

"My hands become snakeheads"

"I am a man (dreamed by a woman)"

"I am Mozart"

CHARACTER

"As I look at his face, it begins to change"

"Even though I know better, Po shows up sporting a head of
dreadlocks"

"A massive creature with the head of Elvis Costello swoops down on the unsuspecting crowd."

SETTING

"I know I'm in my house but the rooms are all wrong"

"The trees in the Black Forest look like giant blades of grass"

"I'm trying to get to my next class but I get lost. The
hallways don't go where they're supposed to"

OBJECT

"I see a silver kangaroo"

"My socks are made of Silly Putty"

"The sign says McPhereson (sic) instead of McDonalds and the arches have nipples"

CONTEXT

If you find yourself in the past, future or some place or situation
that doesn't fit with your waking life, these are also signs that you're dreaming. They're more difficult to recognize while they happen but if they pop up often in your dream journal you'll begin to
recognize them.

EGO ROLE

"I was the King of South Dakota"

"The war raged around me as I pounded Oook's skull with my stone axe"

"I walked down the runway, modeling my dress. My beard didn't match my shoes"

CHARACTER ROLE

"Thomas Jefferson is flying an F-18"

"Meg Ryan is my sister"

"Toby, my pet salamander, is my security system"

CHARACTER PLACE

"Rabble is sitting in a lawnchair"

"My dead friend was with me in the kitchen"

"My family, friends and coworkers were at the picnic"

OBJECT PLACE

"My underwear is stuck to the wall"

"There was a duck on my head"

"My keys were in the garbage disposal"

SETTING PLACE

"I'm at the bottom of the ocean, searching for the ship"

"I was crawling through an air vent"

"Wallstreet? FUCK!!"

SITUATION

"I was camping in the desert"

"A crew was filming a movie in my front yard"

"As I was skiing, I realized that I was on top of an avalanche"

------------------
Character is like a fence - it cannot be strengthened by whitewash.

Check into the chat:
http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/

I AM

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[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-21-2001).]

Rabble Rouser

01-14-2001, 09:18 PM

Thanks Kol. I never looked into this topic before because I can't remember the last time I had a dream. *puts her pen and notebook next to her bed and vows to try some of your techniques*

I'll let you know if anything happens. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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"You did it, Nibbles! Now, nibble through my ball sack!" - Principal Skinner

Koliedrus

01-15-2001, 08:22 AM

I'll hold you to that, Rabble. That goes for the rest of you.

Start now while the idea is fresh in your mind.

I've editted my previous post to include the rest of the dreamsign inventory. Go back and read it again.

Tribals, we're just getting started http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

Once you have a few dreams in your journal, look for dreamsigns. Underline (or highlight) them when you find them.

Once you have about 10 dreams in your journal you'll see a pattern of dreamsigns that crop up more often than others. Once you know what to look for, lucidity is just around the corner.

Keep coming to this thread, people. We've just gotten started.

------------------
Character is like a fence - it cannot be strengthened by whitewash.

Check into the chat:
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I AM

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Mudflap

01-17-2001, 03:05 PM

Me like.

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If you build it, they will come.

This means I'm gutter trash: <IMG SRC="http://geocities.com/matiasjakobsen/green.gif" border=0>

Koliedrus

01-18-2001, 07:56 AM

I'm glad you approve, Mr. Flap http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

Please excuse me for not having posted recently. I've been fighting a nasty little GI bug. Hopefully the worst is over.

There are five major steps to cataloging your dreamsigns. I've mentioned a few but I thought it best to put them in an ordered list so you can see the progression.

1. Dream Journal (if you don't know how, reread the posts.)

2. Identify Dreamsigns
As I stated, find the dreamsigns in your notes and underline them. I always mark each one with a number in the margin as well. Makes them easier to classify.

3. Classify the Dreamsigns
On the blank page after your dream description, list the numbers associated with each dreamsign you found and write its category from the dreamsign inventory above. For instance if you dream of Tom Greene with the body of a jackass, that's a Form dreamsign.

4. Pick a category
Tally up each dreamsign category (awareness, action, form and context) based on their frequency in your list. The category that shows up more often than others is your target category. If there's a tie, pick whichever you prefer.

5. Practice while awake
Once you have a target category, get into the habit of looking for that type of event in your everyday life. If your target is ACTION, pay attention to the way people, machines, pets etc, move. Don't forget that you are also part of your dreams, so think about how YOU move as well. This "study" doesn't have to take up your full awareness. Simply remember why you're doing it and pay a little more attention than you used to.

One comparison for the amount of mental energy it takes:
You're neighbor's dog is missing and you know pretty much what it looks like and how it acts. Anytime you see a dog, you start paying attention. Otherwise, you go about your normal business.

That's enough for this post. From here we'll move on to building a bridge between you active waking life and you actively sleeping mind.

Questions?

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-18-2001).]

Koliedrus

01-18-2001, 06:09 PM

Ask questions at any time. I post lessons at my convenience.

Let's build that bridge.

Now that you know there are certain things you should look for, you'll find that they pop up every day.

I want you to pick a few times during the normal course of your day to look for dreamsigns.

Look for them when you get on an elevator.

Look for them when you start your car.

Look for them when you talk to your teacher.

If your boss's head starts to change before your eyes...

Hell, for that matter, look for them when you take a piss! There're crocodiles in the toilet!

Hopefully you'll forgive me for not going into the details, but a part of your mind is geared to analyze your current situation and pass that information to the rest of your brain in a chain-reaction.

If someone walks up to you with a stern look and draws a fist back, your mind goes to work automatically. Your reaction depends on training as well as previous experience. The same can be said for recognized dreamsigns.

"Critical State Testing" is done whether you're awake or asleep. Certain experiences require special responses. Recognition of a dreamsign (once you recognize one) will illicite an automatic response as well.

Your task follows:

1. Decide when to test your state

Choose five (or more) times during the day to test your state of mind. If you've found a recurring dreamsign category, try to pick predictable events in your everyday routine and make comparisons.

When you pull into the parking lot.
When you ride the elevator.
When you pour your first bowl of Froot Loops.
When you fire up the first joint.

Your lifestyle doesn't matter. You'll experience critical states all day long and into the night. Pick at least 5 times during your waking time to test your critical state. If you experience an extraordinarily high emotional situation, test! It may be a dream. If not, your awareness is hightened.

If you're afraid of heights and you're crossing a bridge, TEST!

2. TEST YOUR CRITICAL STATE

Ask yourself "Am I dreaming?"

It's important that you truly ASK yourself this question and give yourself an accurate response. You can't just mindlessly ask it out of habit and give a preprogrammed answer.

"Am I asleep?"
"No, duh."

LOOK AROUND! Check your surroundings. Notice anything out of the ordinary. Think back a few minutes. If you have trouble remembering, chances are you're dreaming.

One thing I've found that helps to test my state of awareness is to look at something small that has recognizable detail. If my mind cannot retain the detail, I'm dreaming.

Try reading something twice. If you have to pull out your driver's license from your wallet, so be it. If it changes in any way from the first to the second read, you're dreaming.

AArrrg! I hope I haven't confused you. I'm still a bit feverish.

Ask questions so I don't go too fast!

------------------
Character is like a fence - it cannot be strengthened by whitewash.

Check into Tribal Chat! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-18-2001).]

Escape Artist

01-19-2001, 03:12 AM

Kol, I've been having something between a problem and "WTF?!". When at home, I can't get any consciousness during my dreams, and I don't have too many lucid ones...but during an attempt to take my conscious mind with me during the requisite nap in Math I got a feeling of being literally sucked into something, and I saw weird ass green blobs - is this a good thing or am I just nuts? http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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Tribal chat, the 6th food group! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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MuffyTheVampyreLayer

01-19-2001, 01:44 PM

Here is a question for you Kol. What do you do when what your dream becomes reality? I am constantly having violent dreams, and waking up bruised and scratched. Objects which have broken in my dreams, have broken for apparently no reason IRL. I constantly feel like I am in a battle, even though I know I am dreaming, and the only thing that keeps me sane is, fortunately, I have the ability to wake myself.

Koliedrus

01-19-2001, 01:45 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Escape Artist:
Kol, I've been having something between a problem and "WTF" (snip)

[/quote]

First of all you're sleeping in class. That leads me to believe that your study habits need some work. THIS is also a class and I expect you to pay attention to the subject matter and do your homework.

It takes time and practice to get part of your waking mind to follow you into sleep. The procedures I've described thus far aren't magical words that will initiate lucidity after the first read. You must incorporate them into your daily routine.

Like most people, you're probably used to separating each 24 hour period into Awake/Asleep. Each time you begin to nod off you leave the turmoil of your waking life behind. You escape into your subconcious. When you wake up, you escape from your subconcious and start all over.

You forget your waking life when you dream and you forget your dreams when awake.

Your brain is a powerfully complex chunk of matter. It can be directed. Hell, read a good book or play a video game and tell me that you don't fall into an alternate reality. I'll call you a liar.

The barrier between your two states of mind (awake/asleep) is difficult to see through but it is also quite fragile. You need only to poke a hole in it to see the other side. Once you do, you can rip that hole wide open. You already have some of the tools needed to open a gap in the fabric. Now you need to practice using them.

If I may be so bold:

"A hammer will only bounce off of a sheet of rubber but a knife will cleave it easily."

(Damn! I'm getting Zennish again!)

As for the green blobs you saw, you prolly sneezed on your desk while you were asleep in Math I.

Yeah, you're nuts but so am I http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif

'zat help?

Next.

Koliedrus

01-19-2001, 02:13 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by MuffyTheVampyreLayer:
Here is a question for you Kol. What do you do when what your dream becomes reality? I am constantly having violent dreams, and waking up bruised and scratched. Objects which have broken in my dreams, have broken for apparently no reason IRL. I constantly feel like I am in a battle, even though I know I am dreaming, and the only thing that keeps me sane is, fortunately, I have the ability to wake myself.[/quote]

My best guess with the information you provided is that you tend to experience periods of somnambulism (sleepwalking).

Before you disregard it as an impossibility, I've had the experience as well. My episodes came about when I was under overwhelming stress.

In 1973 (I think) the landscape was reshaped by towering funnels of wind, rain and debris. I was in my third year of school when one of the funnels paid a visit.

I was in music class when the doors slammed shut, the air outside became thick and violent and the adults who had always been my mentors fell into panic and sang with tears of fear in their eyes.

Two days later, the image was (obviously) still in my mind. I was at home and sleeping when another storm raged.

My mother gathered up my siblings and hurried them to the lower floor of our house. I was still asleep and small enough to be carried.

As the sound of the wind rose (I'm told) my legs began to move as if I were running. My eyes snapped open in panic and I ran to the safest place I knew; my bed.

I had to be told of this event. I was asleep the entire time. Part of my waking mind followed me to sleep and my body responded.

Think about the circumstances surrounding your life, Muffy. Something may be following you to sleep. I'll help you slay that monster.

Escape Artist

01-19-2001, 05:06 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Koliedrus:

First of all you're sleeping in class. That leads me to believe that your study habits need some work...
[/quote]

Actually, Kol...I slept in class the entire semester because I knew everything that was being taught. I've got a damned good memory, and I learn with little to no problems. In any case, I'm not being lazy about your class, which I'd like to get across from the start. I have much to learn, but if you're going to teach me, you'll have to be damned patient.

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Tribal chat, the 6th food group! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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[This message has been edited by Escape Artist (edited 01-19-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Escape Artist (edited 01-19-2001).]

Bishop

01-20-2001, 08:39 AM

Hey Kol, have you ever heard of or tried something called "Remote Viewing"? http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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Koliedrus

01-20-2001, 01:28 PM

EA: My comments about your study habits were presumptuous. I sincerely apologize for generalizing your circumstance. In fact, the next time you fall asleep in class and get busted, you have my permission to tell your instructor that you are indeed doing homework. Print this thread and have it ready as proof of your claim http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif

As for my patience with your progress, I grant you all the time you require. As long as you're trying, you get an A. In fact, I think I'll work up something tangible for when your efforts begin to pay off. That goes for everyone.

Bishop: Enlighten me http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif "Remote Viewing" rings a bell. Can you describe it, please?

King Bastard

01-20-2001, 07:50 PM

Bishop wil correct me if I'm wrong, but isnt remote viewing something along the lines of clairvoyence? not sure how the 2 would tie in together, other than training yourself to bring your conscious mind to a sleeping state might be similar to training yourself to be able to "remotely" views things and events.

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I'm a firm beliver in a ruling class, especially since I rule: Randall Graves-Clerks
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[This message has been edited by King Bastard (edited 01-20-2001).]

Escape Artist

01-20-2001, 08:23 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Koliedrus:
EA: My comments about your study habits were presumptuous. I sincerely apologize for generalizing your circumstance...
[/quote]

No prob, Kol. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif I await the goodies you have in store. As for this clairvoyance stuff, I've had experiences like that. Odd.

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Tribal chat, the 6th food group! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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Koliedrus

01-21-2001, 03:58 PM

RECESS!!

Enjoy the rest of your weekend!

Dreamsigns v1.2 (above) is now formatted for clarity. Sorry I didn't get to it sooner.

Sleep, dream, play, think. Enjoy your time here while you have it http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-21-2001).]

King Bastard

01-21-2001, 06:54 PM

Ok, so I just got my notebook for class, but I've been reading along the whole time. Also, I've saved what I thought were the core notes as a .doc file, that can be found here (http://www.geocities.com/peejay_2kay/Hypernaut.doc)

I will try to update that once a week, or if there is a lot of new material offered by Kol.

Small suggestion here. Should we archive this thread, and make a new one for the same subject? There's a lot of text to scroll thru, and mayhap new Hypernauts will need to still have it there. The rest of us tho....

And I may start a related thread about my outcomes with lucidity and such. Just not sure if you guys wanna peek that deeply into my gray matter.

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I'm a firm beliver in a ruling class, especially since I rule: Randall Graves-Clerks
<IMG SRC="http://geocities.com/matiasjakobsen/blue.gif" border=0>

Mudflap

01-21-2001, 10:11 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by King Bastard:
Just not sure if you guys wanna peek that deeply into my gray matter.

[/quote]

*pimp-slaps KB's gray matter*

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If you build it, they will come.

King Bastard

01-21-2001, 11:28 PM

13 more.. I'm not kidding...

*looks over his shoulder for the Prof....*

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I'm a firm beliver in a ruling class, especially since I rule: Randall Graves-Clerks
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Princess_Heather

01-22-2001, 03:41 AM

I think we should start a thread for dream journals...

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................ Red on the Head... Fire in the Hole.
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Horgasm

01-22-2001, 03:55 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Princess_Heather:
I think we should start a thread for dream journals...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Then start one!! ! No one is stopping you from doing that. It may be interesting.. .

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About time to DRINK SOME
BURKINA EDIT.. .

[This message has been edited by Horgasm (edited 01-21-2001).]

Princess_Heather

01-22-2001, 04:01 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Horgasm:

Then start one!! ! No one is stopping you from doing that. It may be interesting.. .

[/quote]

I'm hesitant to do that...

I don't know why...

Maybe it's just the way certain members treat me, maybe I'm too lazy, maybe I'd rather someone else start it, maybe I'm having a shitty day and really don't feel like socializing...

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................ Red on the Head... Fire in the Hole.
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Bishop

01-22-2001, 04:39 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by King Bastard:
Bishop wil correct me if I'm wrong, but isnt remote viewing something along the lines of clairvoyence? not sure how the 2 would tie in together, other than training yourself to bring your conscious mind to a sleeping state might be similar to training yourself to be able to "remotely" views things and events.

[/quote]

Close. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif
http://www.crviewer.com/crvpage/qwhatis.htm

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MuffyTheVampyreLayer

01-22-2001, 05:38 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Princess_Heather:

I'm hesitant to do that...

I don't know why...

Maybe it's just the way certain members treat me, maybe I'm too lazy, maybe I'd rather someone else start it, maybe I'm having a shitty day and really don't feel like socializing...
[/quote]
Maybe it is because you never have anything to say that dosn't revolve around yourself?

Seriously, the majority of your remotely human posts are about how much lard you have shaved off your ass over the last two weeks, your body functions, how wonderful a screw your hubby is, or how far you will stick your tongue up other forum members ass's to gain their approval.

Oh, and as for the way forum members treat you, you are being given more than a fair chance in my opinion, so quit yer fucking whining.

Koliedrus

01-22-2001, 07:10 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Princess_Heather:
I think we should start a thread for dream journals...

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you decide to share entries from your dream journals in another thread, I would prefer it if you did so under comfortable circumstances. This isn't a race or a competition. This is all about YOU.
Nothing else.

I may award "prizes" for accomplishments but you'll never be able to add this course to your resume'.

I don't expect a performance but if you decide to report on your successes...

Fire away, Hypernaughts!

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Character is like a fence - it cannot be strengthened by whitewash.

Check into Tribal Chat! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-22-2001).]

Koliedrus

01-22-2001, 07:34 AM

No fighting in here, please, or I'll delete your posts and send you to the office.

Bishop, I do recall CRV now that you've sparked my memory.

Here's the difference between CRV and lucid dreaming:

Remote Viewing
<-- http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/tongue.gif-->

Lucid Dreaming
--> http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/tongue.gif<--

Get it? Lucid dreaming is completely selfish!

Come get some!

Mudflap

01-22-2001, 01:43 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Koliedrus:
No fighting in here, please, or I'll delete your posts and send you to the office.

[/quote]

**simultaneously throws 20 ping pong balls toward front of the class while Kol has his back turned to the class**

**Looks up at celing. Whistles casually**

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If you build it, they will come.

King Bastard

01-22-2001, 05:45 PM

I just have to take the time to say a quick thank you to all of you, but Kol especially. since this thread got started I have noticed a more active recall of my dreams, and can hold onto them for a longer length of time...

That is a gift in and of itself.. Thanks guys.

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I'm a firm beliver in a ruling class, especially since I rule: Randall Graves-Clerks
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Koliedrus

01-22-2001, 07:47 PM

Strap yourself down. It gets better!

More to come soon...

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Character is like a fence - it cannot be strengthened by whitewash.

Check into Tribal Chat! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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Bishop

01-23-2001, 07:56 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Koliedrus:
No fighting in here, please, or I'll delete your posts and send you to the office.

Bishop, I do recall CRV now that you've sparked my memory.

Here's the difference between CRV and lucid dreaming:

Remote Viewing
<-- http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/tongue.gif-->

Lucid Dreaming
--> http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/tongue.gif<--

Get it? Lucid dreaming is completely selfish!

Come get some!

[/quote]

Close, but no cigar! http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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Koliedrus

01-24-2001, 12:05 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by King Bastard:
Ok, so I just got my notebook for class, but I've been reading along the whole time. Also, I've saved what I thought were the core notes as a .doc file, that can be found here (http://www.geocities.com/peejay_2kay/Hypernaut.doc)

I will try to update that once a week, or if there is a lot of new material offered by Kol.

Small suggestion here. Should we archive this thread, and make a new one for the same subject? There's a lot of text to scroll thru, and mayhap new Hypernauts will need to still have it there. The rest of us tho....

And I may start a related thread about my outcomes with lucidity and such. Just not sure if you guys wanna peek that deeply into my gray matter.

[/quote]
KB, I haven't been able to view the notes provided by your link. Is it just me?

I agree that this thread contains enough information to keep neophyte Hypernauts busy for some time. I'll leave it open for the time-being while I get a continuation started.

The beginning of the next phase will deal specifically with initiating lucidity in dreams. Thus far we've discussed methods of enhancing recall. Gaining control of your dreams is the next objective.

Stand by while I compose. As always, be patient.

King Bastard

01-24-2001, 02:15 PM

did you try right clicking and choosing "Save target as"?

Not sure if you can read a .doc file in a browser, and that's the format I saved it in. If this is bad for anyone, let me know what to change it too, and why.

*fidgets in his chair a bit, trying to work out his wedgie in an inconspicous manner*

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'DOH!<IMG SRC="http://geocities.com/matiasjakobsen/blue.gif" border=0>

Koliedrus

01-24-2001, 04:23 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by King Bastard:
did you try right clicking and choosing "Save target as"?

[/quote]

Lo and Behold http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

Content and availability are essential. Format is secondary. Thanks!

KB, check PMs.

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-24-2001).]

King Bastard

01-25-2001, 10:15 AM

done, Tag, you're it.. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Escape Artist

01-27-2001, 09:36 PM

Hmm...I seem to be having some success, there's a phase between sleeping and waking up where I'm occasionally in a converstion with somebody - the thing is that I have somewhat lucid conversations with them, but don't realize that I'm dreaming...it appears I've found my dream sign...any thoughts?

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Tribal chat, the 6th food group! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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Koliedrus

01-28-2001, 12:55 PM

All hail EA!

You have indeed found a recognizable dreamsign! Now you have to establish a link from your waking life to your dreams. In order to do that you need to get into the habit of performing a particular (short) task each and every time you have a conversation with someone. Create a habit.

One way is to print out and carry a card in your wallet that says "Is This A Dream?" followed by some text you can recognize. Try using a favorite lyric or quote.

That's an established method that has worked for me but it's awkward under certain circumstances.

Try this instead:

Make an ink mark somewhere on one of your hands. A small "x" on the skin between two particular fingers works well for me. If you find yourself in a conversation that may be a dream, look for the mark. If you find it, try to change it or move it to another location on your hand. If it stays put, you're probably awake.

Change the location of the mark each time it washes off. Look at it when you need to.

Congratulations, Escape Artist!!! Once you master the dreamsign you've found, you'll be able to simulate all types of face-to-face interractions http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

I'm proud of you! Post an example in the public dreamlog at your convenience. Be only as specific as you wish.

Escape Artist

01-29-2001, 12:37 AM

Will do! I've found that this usually happens when I've been up extremely late and go to sleep...but there's a very small window. I'll figure it out. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

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Koliedrus

01-29-2001, 10:11 AM

That "window" is universal. Since we sleep and wake based on the 24 hour rotation of the Earth, you will necessarily experience a portion of that time in a biologically predetermined state. In other words, you may skip your regular bedtime but your brain will try to dream anyway.

If you stay up, you skip the relaxation portion of your sleep time. You may go straight to REM but you'll be cranky as hell when you have to get up. I don't recommend it. You'll end up losing control of your waking life as well as your dreams. If you can stay in control of yourself, try it sparingly!

I have an "x" on the middle fingernail of my left hand to commemorate your success http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

I'll look for it in my dreams.

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RIF

Check into Tribal Chat! (http://www.thehypertribe.net/irc/)
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Escape Artist

01-30-2001, 02:08 AM

I keep it under tight control - when I know I can sleep until I'm fully rested I'll do it, or I'll simply go to bed earlier, facilitating enough sleep and the usual kick start. http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif I have studying to do! ;-)

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Koliedrus

01-30-2001, 12:21 PM

EA, I got your email. Some of your questions may be answered in the "Hypernaut Training (Phase II)" thread. Look it over.

You're obviously a DILDo with aspirations of getting WILD http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif That's a good thing! Read the thread and you'll see why.

Feel free to ask specific questions about the topics described in the thread. Perhaps you'll remind me of something others should also know.

Before you do, take a look at THIS (http://www.cnn.com/2001/NATURE/01/24/ratdreams.ap/) .

Anyone want to offer an opinion on the article in the link?

[This message has been edited by Koliedrus (edited 01-30-2001).]

Escape Artist

01-30-2001, 07:49 PM

You call me a dildo?! I KILL YOU! http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif I'll go back over the hypernaut topic, I skimmed it a day or two ago. I wonder what researchers could find out from these studies...perhaps the results they gain could be applied to humans, figure out more precisely how they dream. my opinion is that there should be more studies into dreaming, it would definitely increase our understanding of how the human brain works.

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King Bastard

01-31-2001, 03:15 AM

Lovely, first Dennis Quaid, and now RATS are one up on me....

Then again, I've been REALLY stressed out of late, and have to admit to not being the most disciplined pupil.

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'DOH!<IMG SRC="http://geocities.com/matiasjakobsen/blue.gif" border=0>

Koliedrus

01-31-2001, 12:01 PM

PSHAW! Dreamscape was a good concept and DQ represented the first person. The difference is that he's just an actor portraying a role in a Hollywood script and you're the real thing!!!

Rats fuck, eat, sleep and perform tricks. Their lives only get complicated when humans get involved. Now it turns out that their simple lives mimic ours in another way; they dream!

In your case, KB, I wonder if there is some "rat" that has complicated your life to cause you stress.

The good news is that a rat (or lab mouse) has more similarities to us than we previously thought http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

The bad news is that a rat (or lab mouse) has more similarities to us than we previously thought http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/frown.gif

I'm gonna take the good news and run with it.

Right after I get another beer. This one is half empty.

Koliedrus

02-05-2001, 01:39 AM

Whoops! Lookit me reply to myself again http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif

I have a gadget that helps me get into lucid dreams quicker. Is that cheating?

It's a sleeping mask with integrated electronics that monitor the movement of my eyes and produces lights and/or tones when I enter REM.

I haven't tried connecting it to a laptop but it's an option.

Yo, HOWDY! I LOVE this shit! http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/biggrin.gif

mute

03-20-2001, 08:05 AM

do you have to have good sleeping habits to be able to go on with this training?

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Koliedrus

03-20-2001, 01:12 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Mute:
do you have to have good sleeping habits to be able to go on with this training?

[/quote]
For optimal results, the answer is yes. The word "training" has as much meaning in this endeavor as in any other. As an example, you'll never play a guitar worth a damn if you don't practice regularly. Judging by your artwork, Mute, it seems as though you already know how to practice your abilities. Fortunately, sleep and dreams happen regularly for most people so the sessions are already scheduled. If you suffer from insomnia, that's a whole 'nuther animal altogether.

Start from the beginning. Learn to relax. Hopefully that isn't a contradiction of terms.

Once you've had some success with this introductory level, move on to the Phase II but don't rush yourself. This isn't a competition. Think of it as a gift that you didn't know you had. Now that the package is unwrapped, you need to read and follow the operating instructions to make it work.
(Batteries are included. You were born with them http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif )

Hypernauts, feel free to post questions here or email me if you wish to avoid public scrutiny. I'll do my best to assist.

mute

03-20-2001, 02:32 PM

since the last pot, i went to sleep , with my log handy!, and it was worth it, i had a dream!
i just woke up from it and worte it down. but i have a question now. while i as writing down my dream, i knew "why" i saw or did certain things in my dream from the stuff during my day.. but some stuff is a mystery... is it good to know where those certain stuff came from?

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mute

03-20-2001, 02:52 PM

oh yea, when i asked about "good sleeping habits", i meant, well, i should ask is my sleeping habits good?

sometimes i get 5 hours sleep(work) and sometimes i sleep in, overall 10 hours sleep... should i make myself sleep around 8 hours a night..? or can i go through with my sleep habits...
i find mine weird cause whenever i have time off i stay up till like around 3-5am, but when i gotta work i have to goto bed around 11 or 12.... is that time difference of when going to bed make it harder to complete this?

i'm always relaxed when i goto bed, it's just i feel real groggy during the day sometimes, and i'm a mongoloid....

also, smoking bud won't hurt this training will it?

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mute

03-20-2001, 08:06 PM

well, had a lil 3 hour nap this afternoon, and guess what? 2 fucking dreams, i've never had that many in one day.... fucking a
well more questions now, this has happened before too...
when i nap, i wake up for lil 5 second period, then fall back asleep, sometimes when i wake my mind is still in la la land(dreaming)... and i say things to people that are near me (like my friends playing the computer)... i'd say something to them, like they were in my dream and i was talking to them, though they had no clue what i was talking about....
for example like today, in my dream i was playing Counter-Strike, and i was a terroist and a counter-terroist came around the corner, i killed him... i knew there was another CT around the corner, and i said to my friends playing the computer (talking about the sims) "no, but there's another guy around the corner."
also while i was playing the game, it felt like i was really in the game, like it was real life, but a video-game.(like i could move the arms and legs like i wanted)

i guess it was like i was telling my terroist friends who were slacking off theres another CT around the corner....

sorry to ask you all this shit, i'm thinking you know a lot about dreams... and now i don't know why i wrote all this down cause i forget the question, something about when you "sleep-talk" and people in the real world hear you...
it's weird cause i remember saying these things sometimes.. i remember waking up and saying this, then falling back asleep... the dreams also ends when i fall back to sleep..

sorry to bug ya http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/eek.gif this shit's starting to get interesting

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Koliedrus

03-21-2001, 01:46 PM

Told ya http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/wink.gif

If you can't figure out where some of the images originate, don't fret. Your memories are the raw materials for your dreams. You'll tap different areas as you go along.

As for your sleeping habits, as long as you have sleeping "habits" (regular sleeping periods) they can be considered to be "good" in this endeavor. Practice determining your critical state and the time of day/night will become irrelevant.

As for smoking bud, anything that dims your ability to retain concentration will have a negative effect. If your imagination flits quickly from one thought to another or stalls completely, your efforts will be for naught. In order to carry your intention with you into sleep, a clear mind will carry you quickly to your goal.

FYI, your questions won't bug me. Why do you think I started this training session http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

Ask away.

mute

03-21-2001, 11:44 PM

well, i seem to be doing alright, cept last night, well is should say morning, i stayed up till 8am..wen to be and i remember having a dream, but i don't remember what happened..

only one part of it i do though, and i remembered it driving to work...
in my dream, i remember being at this bar(don't know what bar) and i saw 2 guys i know, this time though, i had control and said "wasap"...
i remembered that part cause on my way to work i saw the kind of car the guy drives..

when i'm high, i think about things weird.. but i don't drift from one thought to another... and when i goto bed i'm relaxed, but burnt...

also another weird thing, last night when falling alseep, i started to dream, but was still awake in a sense...

i'm making absolutely no sense eh?

this shit is starting to get hard!! i'm examining things way too much...

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Koliedrus

03-22-2001, 01:08 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Mute:
last night when falling alseep, i started to dream, but was still awake in a sense...

i'm making absolutely no sense eh?

this shit is starting to get hard!! i'm examining things way too much...

[/quote]

Makes perfect sense to me http://www.thehypertribe.net/ubb/smile.gif

If I may use another analogy...
Bodybuilding

At first you get sore. Eventually your muscles become accustomed but you still need to give them a rest. Each time you work out you're just a little stronger.

Falling asleep and being "awake" (aware) is the main goal here. Looks to me like your efforts are paying off.

You're getting it, Mute. I'll spot you.

mute

03-22-2001, 05:24 PM

it's fucked! you know why...

some girl i know was telling me how to "meditate"... it's pretty much full relaxation of muscles and mind... like the relaxation lessons you posted before....

but i was trying this after being up for 19 hours... but it kinda worked... i lost all tension in my muscles and they were relaxed... then i was passing every thought that went by.. like, "see ya later thought", and the girl told me , "then once you are completley relaxed, you can give yourself a voice, sorta like a hypnotist, that can tell you what to do."

it was sorta like that, but this voice was me, or my "waking mind" i'd say... i started to dream and i saw a face of someone i don't even know(imagiantion)... and i started to drift off to sleep... and i heard my voice saying,"where are you going patty?", "patty don't leave just yet"...

like i was losing my waking mind... pretty damn freaky.. i wouldn't of noticed these things before..

waking mind means you, your mind, during the times you're awake right? you're controlled mind?

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mute

03-22-2001, 05:27 PM

oh yea, a question...

last night i had a reaal long dream, and woke up at 8am, wrote it down, and went back to bed... i had 2 other dreams after that... and i didn't feel like writing them down.. should i?
i'm goin to write the one i didn't right now, but is it a bad thing to do to pass some dreams up?

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mute

03-22-2001, 05:31 PM

haha i forgot something..
this goes along with that question, right above this one... only dream i didn't write down was the one about meeting the friend at the bar, since it was so short, and i didn't remember the whole dream, i thouht not to write it down... should i?

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Koliedrus

03-23-2001, 12:42 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR>Originally posted by Mute:
oh yea, a question...

last night i had a reaal long dream, and woke up at 8am, wrote it down, and went back to bed... i had 2 other dreams after that... and i didn't feel like writing them down.. should i?
i'm goin to write the one i didn't right now, but is it a bad thing to do to pass some dreams up?

[/quote]

The more dreams you have in your journal, the better your chances of spotting a recognizable dreamsign. One vivid dream may contain a lot of information but a lot of dreams over an extended period of time will produce a pattern.

At the same time, don't burn yourself out by getting up to jot down notes if you start to dread doing so. If you're lucky enough to be one of the few who can recall dreams without memory cues, write them down when you wake up. Your goal is to get at least ten dreams in your jounal before you begin your analysis.

I don't write notes on every dream because I'm already familiar with my patterns; I know what to look for.

Always keep in mind that the journal is for YOUR benefit. It's just a tool. You won't be graded on content since it is (in essence) written for your eyes only. In fact, I wouldn't recommend showing it to ANYONE since the recognition of specific dreamsigns should come from you.

As an alternative to writing notes after a dream, you may want to consider an audio recorder. Dream, wake, describe, go back to sleep. When you're ready, listen to your notes and THEN write them in your journal. Fill in details from memory. I sometimes use a voice activated tape-recorder so I don't have to fumble around for lights, pens or switches. I just talk and go back to sleep.

You're making progress!