The "Talk about the new front page" thread.

[Pianomahnn]

Talk to me.

[SimpleSimon]

What front page?

You can't get there from here. Used to be, I'd just click on the "Hypertribe" banner at the top of the forums index. That does nothing at all now. As far as I can tell, the forums index IS the front page.

[Pianomahnn]

Damnit!!!

See Mac, I told you!!!!!

Its actually used only as a portal for newbies and bots. Whats on the front page can be accessed here.

[MAC]

your mother and I are very disappointed in you

*MAC takes all the blame*
I just wanted my ancient front page article taken down and something cool and new put up.

:p

http://mac.cookingwithdiesel.net/images/crap/makemeasammich%20copy.jpg

[Mudflap]

What front page?

You can't get there from here. Used to be, I'd just click on the "Hypertribe" banner at the top of the forums index. That does nothing at all now. As far as I can tell, the forums index IS the front page.


I have http://www.thehypertribe.net/ bookmarked and it takes me to the front page every time. From there I access the forum index.

[Escape Artist]

I second the "What front page?" question.

You've got a front-end for another front-end now, with an abysmal lack of readability, content, and originality.

I'm fucking disappointed, it sucks ass. May as well be the one who says it.

[Koliedrus]

I used to click straight throught to the forum.

Not any more. I like it. The old one was static.

[Pianomahnn]

I second the "What front page?" question.

You've got a front-end for another front-end now, with an abysmal lack of readability, content, and originality.

I'm fucking disappointed, it sucks ass. May as well be the one who says it.

The content is essentially what exists in here. If thats an abysmal lack of content the blame is on you, me, and anyone else posting here.

I dont really think anyone on this forum should ever need to visit the front page. As veteran posters there is no reason for us to go there. Hell, I don't even think we need one. However, it's been chatted about long in the past, and people felt it was necessary, so it remains. I would be fine with abolishing the front page...

Regardless of my opinions, it remains. EA, perhaps you could offer me up some constructive criticism on what would work better. As it stand, all I have is horseshit out there, but no one telling me how to make it better.

[Koliedrus]

Indeed, no one is telling you how to make it better.
You already have, in my opinion.

This whole thing has been an experiment from day one. So it continues to be. I, for one, recognize the effort and thought it took to create a dynamic front page that used to be ignored by members and staff alike.

The layout is such that I may finally start to see posts that normally pass me by and I may also get a birthday wish written sooner than the day after.

I think it allows members to "take it all in" at a glance. If there are navigational tweaks or aesthetic alterations that need to be made, here is Chis' offer to address them.

[Escape Artist]

The content is essentially what exists in here. If thats an abysmal lack of content the blame is on you, me, and anyone else posting here.

I dont really think anyone on this forum should ever need to visit the front page. As veteran posters there is no reason for us to go there. Hell, I don't even think we need one. However, it's been chatted about long in the past, and people felt it was necessary, so it remains. I would be fine with abolishing the front page...

Regardless of my opinions, it remains. EA, perhaps you could offer me up some constructive criticism on what would work better. As it stand, all I have is horseshit out there, but no one telling me how to make it better.


Fair enough, will come back and edit this post later with some more ideas and whatnot.

My suggestion is to eliminate the front page altogether; put in a redirect page that sends people directly to the forum index.

[Pianomahnn]

I would like to make it known that I did not create the front page. I used what I consider to be a very functional portal created by someone else. I did still nee to make a number of tweaks and alterations. So there was a few hours of effort on my part, but hardly as much effort as it took for me to create the cam portals which used to work but dont work so much anymore because it took so damned long before I dont have that much time now and that just sucks because I keep typing without any punctuation maybe because I want to be like some really cool interweb emo kids.

[Escape Artist]

Who You Iz, An' Where Yer Goin'

Generally speaking, sites will fall into one of three categories:

1. Forum only, has visitor base to support such a venture. Purpose of site is decentralized enough to render any front page useless.

2. Front page with occasionally updated user content, archived notable content, and other resources for members as an aside - contextual news tickers, photo galleries, etc.

3. Site with central purpose, uses front page as a placeholder with static content striking enough to attract people initially, and direct them to the forums for continued participation.

THT in particular has a special problem here. Any of the above, if followed up on with a bit of effort and attention, should usually result in a thriving website.

This site cannot fit into number 1. It needs the front page to get new people interested enough to visit the forums, and lacks an adequate visitor base and post turnover to draw new people on word-of-mouth alone.

It had number 2, to some extent, in an attempt to rebuild and expand capabilities to support 1.

Ideally, you and MAC and those who are left would have taken the seed idea and expanded upon it. I'll get to the issues involved with the current approach shortly.

It started with a large helping of number 3, for those of you who can remember that far back. RW had striking content by the boatload and a forum for everyone to yak about it. He made use of the forum as a vehicle to take advantage of #2's advantages.

The optimal method should be fairly obvious by this point, but to clarify: Get impressive, interesting content and update/expand on it whilst keeping it simple to find and browse. Maintaining a high demand for quality ensures it is attractive and will interest people.

<hr>

Hard-Cock-Man Sells Widgets

So this buddy of mine, Hard-Cock-Man (he insists on being called that, for some reason) decides that he's tired of eating dryer lint to survive.

He looks around at the thriving e-businesses that are still left and determines that it really can't be that difficult to make enough money to upgrade his diet to drywall shavings and plug tobacco.

I hear of this, and ask him what he's gonna sell.

"Hell, I'll just put up everything I can think of, some idiot will bite! Then I can just go buy it and charge them a little more than I pay whenever someone wants something! It's foolproof!"

Three weeks of feverish efforts at the command line of an Apple II, and he's got a directory of products that would rival God's Index to life. Puts it on the web and waits for the seemingly inevitable millions to roll in.

Member of the public comes along, and tries to find a garden hose. After manually searching the site they get frustrated and give up. It's not in Home > Housewares > Outside > Garage Items > Garden or anything related.

EA comes along looking for a Taiwanese knockoff of a RealDoll. He notes the excessive site structure and digs through it anyway, eventually falling upon what he wants.

Well, for all his efforts, Hard-Cock-Man just can't get his hands on one. He listed them, of course, assuming that he should be able to, and that if he had everything demand had to stay high.

Dryers in the Detroit area still have not recovered from his desperate hunger, suffice it to say.

------------------------------------------------------------------

The object lesson here:

Don't put up categories and pages for stuff and assume you will, and can, later fill them with content.

You'll frustrate people by sending them down a bumpy road that leads to a dead end, or you'll have someone expect the content and go "Hey, man....pay the fuck up!"

The worst possible result is that people see all the pages, know there is nothing on 90% of them, and flip the site the bird - even if page 96 had a great price on IDE controller cards. Those people are often the ones you want to retain.

Hell, you wouldn't fill a filing cabinet with folders for every conceivable document you might possess just to be on the safe side, would you? Similar principles apply here.

Now, if we pull up the front page, we see the filing cabinet problem:

The filing cabinet isn't being utilized enough, so we'll just expand the kind of stuff we put in it, naturally it'll have to be indispensable as a result.

Three rotting turkey carcasses, slew of ruined documents, and a HazMat visit, and...well....you get the drift.

You can't use a bucket as a hammer, even if there's no water to hold and you need to pound nails. Keep it simple, and you'll keep people. Improve efficiency and organization for the person who would use all this stuff, but can't.

This leads us to an advantageous point in doing so...

<hr>

Hard-Cock-Man Loves Shiny Things

Hard-Cock-Man's browsing the web looking for triple-reverse-gender-change pr0n from Indonesia.

Don't ask.

One day, he hits paydirt and comes across a small site...there isn't that much in the way of content, as it's pretty new to the scene.

It's well organized and has some pretty damn good introductory stuff, and they update bi-weekly with the best pr0ns they find. He subconsciously notices this and becomes a regular visitor.

Visually the site looks like Little Timmy's HomePage Thinger, unfortunately - and Hard-Cock-Man is the determined exception to many potential visitors.

The site plugs along and despite the visuals, they get more and more people, but it is a limited following. Many people browsing are turned off by the fact that the site just looks like crap.

Eventually, the proprietor notices this, and completely redesigns to a professional quality standard. A huge outpouring of new members and interested parties results. He and his server are almost overwhelmed completely by the amount of material he's receiving and the visitor base that has formed nearly overnight.

A lasting membership base forms and all parties benefit highly from the exchanges that occur.

------------------------------------------------------------------

As you can see, good content - even if limited - is highly important, but how it is delivered is just as important - even moreso at times.

The initial impressions people get about a site, a person, a car, or even computers - all come from initial appearances. If you want to maximize your userbase and the diversity of your content, you MUST take advantage of this fact. If you want a userbase that can add to and improve your content for your site, it is absolutely paramount.

There have been many places that became powerhouses through trial and error in discovering the above - lot of us older members are from one in particular - but a hell of a lot more have had innovative ideas and abject failure.

Why? They simply would not make their site as accessible as they could. There are a lot of people who care only about the content and will shovel through a ton of shit to get at it...but there are just as many who are more discriminating and will be turned off, too.

To reinforce this point, look at the evolution of Linux in general; they are just starting to get the idea that appearance, usability and so forth is important for continued growth. How much more could they have done if they took the lead of Macintosh or Windows?

Example:

Windows - user friendly, large amount of content, badly organized and prone to failure.

Macintosh - extremely high accessibility, good organization, relatively low content levels.

Linux - lowest accessibility, high content levels, minimal organization.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Should be obvious what needs to be changed by each. :)

<hr>

That's that for this segment.

[GLENDOWER]

As the newb in the group (yes, I'm still here) I think the front page was helpful.

[Billyman]

I for one visit the front page every once in while. I do like the new one I must say.

Soooo………ahm…….how hard can it possibly be to create a freakin’ button ON THE FORUM’S MAIN PAGE to link back to it?

That’s all I’ve got to say about that.

[Pianomahnn]

Yea, workin' on that one.

Actually, there is a link. Bottom right hand corner of every page...really not convenient, but it works for now.

My goal, of course, is to make that big ass logo at the top a link. Or, better yet, just h4x0r the mapping so the top level is front page, second is forums, etc. That would take more work, but probably be more kickass.

It took me 40billion years to fix the front page from when mac first requested. Heh...maybe this wont take as long.

[Escape Artist]

all ya have to do is edit the header/footer/forumdisplay templates, as i recall - doesn't take that long.

[Billyman]

Yea, workin' on that one.

Actually, there is a link. Bottom right hand corner of every page...really not convenient, but it works for now.

My goal, of course, is to make that big ass logo at the top a link. Or, better yet, just h4x0r the mapping so the top level is front page, second is forums, etc. That would take more work, but probably be more kickass.

It took me 40billion years to fix the front page from when mac first requested. Heh...maybe this wont take as long.

You go girl!!